Abou ‘Bu’ Thiam on Managing Kanye & Chris Brown, His BuVision Label at Atlantic & Breaking New Artists

To the uninitiated, Abou “Bu” Thiam is most known as Akon’s younger brother, the subject of a line in the MC’s 2008 Billboard Hot 100 hit “I’m So Paid”: “My little brother Bu got that vision, baby.”

For those in the know, however, he’s quietly become a very successful businessman in the music industry over the past 20 years. He’s worked with not only his brother, but artists such as Lady Gaga, Rihanna, Jay-Z, Kanye West, Chris Brown, T-Pain and Jeremih — as a record executive at Def Jam and Columbia, as an artist manager and, most recently, as the founder and CEO of BuVision, an imprint for which he recently signed a partnership deal with Atlantic Records. An accomplished A&R and manager, his credits include working on albums like Rih’s Talk That Talk, Jay and Ye’s Watch The Throne and DONDA, among many others; signing Gaga to her first deal with Interscope through his and Akon’s Konvikt Music; signing 4Batz and Central Cee to Columbia; and managing the careers of Ye and Brown at different times. 

Now, with BuVision through Atlantic, where he brought 4Batz, he has been working to break the rising star Sailorr, whose “POOKIE’S REQUIEM” reached No. 10 on Billboard’s Hot R&B Songs last year and who was named Billboard’s R&B Rookie of the Month in February.

“Sailorr has one of the most incredible pens in the industry, and I’m excited about the moment she’s having,” Thiam tells Billboard. “She’s done a great job understanding how to build her own world on her own, she has incredible taste and great instincts, and now it’s about supporting her and allowing her growth to be organic between her and her fans.”

Thiam, who is based in Atlanta, had spent the past three years as executive vp of A&R at Columbia, where he learned under the tutelage of Columbia CEO Ron Perry. “I give him so much respect because nobody saw what I could be — LA Reid first, but then Ron years later, really honed in on my gifts,” Thiam says. “Ron is kind of like me; we’re both artists at heart. He not only ran a company, but he sold one, so he understood that dynamic. So being there for those years really educated me on how to run my own company.”

Getting his start alongside his brother in the early 2000s, Thiam enjoyed a successful stint as an executive at Def Jam before starting his management odyssey, ultimately working with Brown through much of the 2010s and then helping shepherd Ye through the DONDA period, before returning to the label world. Of his new deal with Atlantic, he says, “Elliot [Grainge] gave me the vision of where he was taking Atlantic and 10K, and I thought it was really impressive.

“I’ve also seen the company that he’s built with Zach [Friedman] and Tony [Talamo] over the years, and I’ve always been impressed with their work ethic and how they’ve been able to build something so small that became so big,” Thiam adds. “Every time I was trying to sign an artist, they were at the table — they were really my only competition in closing artists. So I was like, if we join forces together, I can just imagine what that can be. So it just made sense.”

Here, Thiam discusses his journey through the music business, his work with some of the most high-profile stars of the century and what keeps him optimistic about the music business moving forward. “I look forward to change, I embrace it, I think it’s necessary, and I also feel that regardless of what happens, nothing will ever be able to replace the core of what we do when it comes to music,” he says. “Nothing will ever be able to change how you feel when you go see someone perform at a concert, or when you meet your favorite superstar, or when you listen to your favorite album. Will the business change? Of course; it always does. But I’m all about the music, and that will never change. It’s about how we adapt to not get left behind.”

You’re based in Atlanta. What’s your setup like there?

Offices can feel, for me, like a trap; it’s not creative at all. So when I decided I wanted to have my base in Atlanta, I was like, I need a house, not only to do business and have my crew in there talking about strategy, but also, if I’m in the studio with an artist and we make a great song, I can walk next door into my living room or a conference room and talk about a video idea in real time. Oftentimes, when you work in a corporate structure, to do that takes so many layers of getting everyone on email, having meetings, discussing the single. Whereas with BuVision, if you’ve got a good idea, everyone is there to talk about it. When you hear a good song and then can talk about a video and a marketing plan on the spot while the song is being made, that has always been my success.

You started in this business working with your brother at Konvict, then worked at Def Jam, then with Kanye, Chris Brown, Rihanna. What’d you learn each step of the way that led you to this point?

Working with my brother was a blessing because I was able to just be me; I didn’t have to work through the trials and errors of having to fit in or work my way up. He allowed me to be 100 percent who I was. So when I met someone like a Rihanna, we clicked very well because I was very honest and real about my opinions, and she accepted it. Then when I met ’Ye in Hawaii, same thing, I was there for three days, and he was like, “LA Reid, can he stay with me for a week or two?”

Artists that are stars, they are so used to everyone being yes men, and they can tell when you’re saying things to make them feel good. So when you’re honest and genuine in your approach and how you feel, those are the people they usually keep around them, because they don’t have a lot of that.

Where did that confidence come from?

I’m the youngest boy out of four, so I’ve always had to overachieve. And I truly believe in my heart that I’m blessed, that it’s not luck, it’s truly a gift. And knowing that gives me the confidence to execute. Early on, my brother ‘Kon was the first to give me that confidence, and then working with big artists and having success at a high level, when most of the time they were at their lowest, gave me confidence. Working with Rihanna when she had Rated R, an album that wasn’t her best one, and then I come along with LA Reid and Ester Dean and we make Loud and Talk That Talk and people are like, “Oh, she’s back!” She had never left, but it was a grey area at a time. When I met Chris Brown, he was at a low, and I brought in “Loyal” and that just sparked the whole s–t again. I worked with Kanye West when he was wearing the [MAGA] hat, and we did DONDA. So always overachieving helped me with my confidence as well.

Why did you want to go into management?

When I got to Def Jam, LA Reid was there, and then with the reorganization, he went to Epic. I didn’t have a relationship with Lucian [Grainge], and I didn’t want to be somewhere where no one knows me. That was when I met Chris Brown, and I started managing Chris. 

I used to get so frustrated as an A&R, because I felt like I didn’t have the power to see my vision through; I would make a record with an artist and then my job was done. But I felt like I was more valuable, that I could help with the marketing, help with the rollout. But when you work at a company, there are tiers: you do your job, you pass it to the next department and they do theirs, and on and on. So I decided I wanted to manage, because you’re managing their whole career, not just the record side.

But I didn’t realize you have to babysit someone, too, you know what I mean? [Laughs] I gotta deal with this dude’s personal life, too. And that’s my brother, so it’s all love, and that’s a part of it, but you have to do all these other things that I felt was taking away a lot of my time. It’s a very demanding job, a 24-hour job, and the one thing I didn’t love about it was that it felt like, as a manager, you always made decisions based on your job. Because otherwise you would get fired. Do you tell the artist how you truly feel, or do you just say yes and keep the commission? And I didn’t want to have to become the yes man. So I decided to do something else — until ’Ye called me.

I got to Wyoming, he was working on DONDA, and I was like, “We should do this, we should do that.” He was like, “Why don’t you just manage me?” And Ye is the most persistent person in the world. So I was like, “Listen, I’ll just manage the music side of your career while we’re doing DONDA” — until he finds someone else. Because with ’Ye, as much as I love him, he fires you 10 times. And then he never fired me.

Then we kept working and had a lot of success. We did DONDA, we did the stadium listenings in Atlanta, Chicago. And then it came back to what I was saying earlier — I just got tired of being a vessel. That was the first time in my career where I was like, “I’m tired of building someone else’s empire.” And it was time for me to focus on just me and what I wanted to be and what I wanted to build.

What did you learn from the management world?

From managing Kanye and Chris Brown? Well, one, that I’m f—ing nuts. [Laughs] You’re talking about two guys who have a strong mindset of what they want, how they want it, when they want it. But I learned that it’s damn near impossible to manage a superstar and build around it. That’s why I give credit to Sal [Slaiby] — how do you manage The Weeknd and also build a company? When I look at Future [The Prince], who manages Drake, he only manages Drake. Because at some point, the relationship between an artist and a manager is going to strain, because superstars want you to themselves, and if you’re working with someone else, it’s gonna start to feel like they’re sharing with the other person. I went into it with big dreams of building my own company, and I realized early that that was not going to be possible. And I think that was also a factor of why I realized I didn’t want to be in the management business in that capacity.

Why did you want to come to Atlantic? 

I felt like my destiny was to be here, and I can’t tell you how much I appreciate and respect and admire what Elliot and Zach and these guys have been able to do here. I’ve just been impressed at how they move. These guys don’t go to bed. They’ll call me at four in the morning and just go, “Let’s go, let’s kill, let’s kill!” I feel like we just have this alpha energy, kill everybody mentality. So I feel like I’m around A-alikes. And I believe everything happens for a reason, because I came to Atlantic/10K, and literally before I even put a desk in my office, we started having success.

What did Elliot say that sold you on the vision for the company?

I look at everything in life like sports: to win, it’s not about one person, it’s about the team. If you look at football, the free safety just roams; if you want the best out of Bu, you have to allow me to roam and do what I do. And Elliot was like, “I just want you to be you. I know who you are, let’s get it, let’s talk about it. What do you need? How do you want your title to read?” He gave me a blank sheet and was like, “I want you to mark how you want this to work out for you and for us.” And I did, and it was done. 

You brought 4Batz over and you have Sailorr and Georgiana, too. How are things working in the new setup?

Sailorr is so important to me. All my artists are, but with her, Batz, Georgiana, I feel for the first time I’ve been able to fully have my team in a place where we can do artist development. And it’s been a great process here with the team at 10K and Atlantic, talking about storytelling. She’s been great, she listens, she trusts me and the team and what we do, and so far, so good. I’m excited for her future because I know how bad she wanted this.

Batz had success early on and went through a phase of depression, because he didn’t know how to handle success — no one can. He was successful so fast and so quick that he didn’t know how to deal with what came with it. And even with me at his side, walking him through it, he had to go through it himself. And he did, and now he’s back and he’s strong and he’s happy and back to doing what he does best. I used to say, “Listen, music aside, focus on the mental. We can always make a song.” And he took his time, and he’s back. I’m excited.

And I’m really excited about Elkan, who produced Drake’s “Nokia” record. Us and Toibox, which is his company, and Atlantic Records, that will be our next thing. Get your popcorn ready.

You’ve been doing this for over 20 years now. Over that time, the music business has changed significantly. How have you managed to stay on top of things?

From when I first came into the game, there aren’t too many people around that were around back then, you know? I’ve just been able to adapt by educating myself on what was changing and not being stuck in my ways. I think oftentimes when you’re stuck in your ways, you get old. What I do today is not what I did 10, 15 years ago. I keep myself young by adapting, educating myself and being around young kids. My whole staff is under 23 years old. The president of my company, Malik, is 23 years old. So I’m around nothing but young kids, and I listen to them and educate myself, but more importantly, adapting with the times and not letting my old self dictate new thoughts. That’s really helped me.

And more importantly than that, the way I was raised shaped my ears. Not to sound cocky, but you can’t name too many people that can work on a Lady Gaga record, a Rihanna record, a Young Jeezy record, then go do Watch The Throne, then go do an R&B album with Chris Brown. Most people that do what I do are very one-dimensional. I was raised in an African household. My parents were African and they were poor, so I grew up in the streets, but then every summer I went to Africa. At the time, Africa was pre-internet, and all you heard was Hot 100 records. So it gave me the opportunity to have a pop ear, but also a street edge, and I mixed that up. That’s always been my advantage and edge over others — I can do all genres really well, and most others can’t.